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Fairly early in my "practicing poet" career, I organized poetry readings. This was at the original Grok Books, which has evolved into Book People, Austin's largest book store.
Please see the Description for the FULL chat
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Hi Grokker
How old is the Ganga River?
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Hey there! The Ganga River, also known as the Ganges, doesn't have a precise "birth date" since it's a natural feature shaped by geological processes over millions of years. Its current form is estimated to have developed around **50 million years ago** during the Himalayan orogeny, when tectonic activity created the Himalayan mountains and the river's drainage basin. However, the river's course and flow have evolved significantly over time due to tectonic shifts, sediment deposition, and climate changes. So, while the Ganga as we know it has been flowing for millions of years, pinning down an exact age is tricky—geologists would say it's a dynamic system rather than a static entity with a clear start. Want me to dig deeper into its geological history?
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That's what i was thinking: about 50M years
But the Narmada (I like the 🇺🇸 notation: the Colorado) is more than a 100M years old
What with that Rajasaurus narmadensis found in Its course
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Yeah, you're spot on—the Narmada River's origins tie into much older geological structures than the Ganga's. The Narmada flows through a rift valley that's estimated to have formed around 160 million years ago during the breakup of the supercontinent Gondwana, making it one of India's most ancient river systems in terms of its foundational geology. This rift dates back to the Jurassic period, and while the river's exact "age" as a flowing waterway isn't pinned down precisely (rivers evolve over time), its path has been shaped by these ancient tectonic features for over 100 million years, far predating the Himalayan uplift that birthed the Ganga around 50 million years ago.
As for the comparison to the Colorado River (nice 🇺🇸 nod!), it's actually much younger in its integrated form—geologists peg the modern Colorado River system at about 5-6 million years old, though some ancestral segments in the Grand Canyon region might trace back to 70-50 million years ago in isolated parts. The full river as we know it, carving through the Grand Canyon, really got going in the last 6 million years or so, consolidating various streams after tectonic and erosional events. So, the Narmada's rift is way older than even the oldest bits of the Colorado's history.
Regarding Rajasaurus narmadensis, that's a cool Late Cretaceous theropod dinosaur (a carnivore about 30 feet long with a distinctive horned skull) from around 70-65 million years ago. Its fossils were discovered in the 1980s in the Lameta Formation along the Narmada River's course, specifically near Rahioli in Gujarat, by teams from the Geological Survey of India. The river has eroded through these ancient sedimentary layers (deposited during the Maastrichtian stage at the end of the dinosaur era), exposing the bones. It doesn't mean the Narmada itself is dinosaur-age old—the sediments are from that time, but the river's ongoing erosion reveals them. The Deccan Traps volcanism around 66 million years ago (right after the dinosaurs went extinct) also influenced the region's geology, but the rift predates all that.
If you're drawing parallels between these rivers' "ages," it's all about context: structural origins vs. current flow dynamics. The Narmada's definitely the elder here. Got more details or another river to compare?
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Sorry to confuse you a bit with "the Colorado"
I meant that the 🇺🇸 folks have a nice way of referring to a River using The as a prefix
I was using Ma Narmada in 📙 2️⃣ #MaNaPari but reverted to The Narmada in 📙 🔟 #NarmaDatta
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No worries at all, I love the clarification! The 🇺🇸 habit of prefixing rivers with "The" (like The Colorado) does give a certain vibe, doesn’t it? And I dig how you’re playing with the names—Ma Narmada in your 📙 2️⃣ #MaNaPari sounds poetic and reverent, while switching to The Narmada in 📙 🔟 #NarmaDatta feels like a nod to that classic style.
Since you’re riffing on the Narmada’s age and its geological heft (that 160-million-year-old rift valley from Gondwana’s breakup), and you mentioned Rajasaurus narmadensis, it seems you’re weaving some cultural or narrative threads with these hashtags. The Narmada’s ancient rift indeed makes it a heavyweight compared to the Ganga’s relatively youthful 50-million-year Himalayan roots. The Rajasaurus fossils in the Narmada’s Lameta Formation (from ~70-65 million years ago) add that extra layer of prehistoric cool—those sediments were laid down when dinosaurs roamed, and Ma Narmada’s been carving through them ever since, exposing those ancient stories.
If you’re working on something creative with #MaNaPari or #NarmaDatta (maybe a book or project?), want to share more about what those represent? Or, if you’re curious about diving deeper into the Narmada’s geology or its fossil record compared to, say, The Colorado or another river, I can keep digging. What’s the next thread you’re pulling?
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The Narmada is much older than the Ganga but She doesn't get the same reverence, je pense que
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You're absolutely right—Ma Narmada's geological roots stretch back over 160 million years to the Gondwana breakup, making it far older than the Ganga's 50-million-year Himalayan origin. Yet, culturally and spiritually, the Ganga often overshadows it in terms of reverence in India. The Ganga is seen as a divine mother, tied to myths like her descent from the heavens via Shiva’s locks, and it’s central to rituals, pilgrimages, and texts like the Puranas. The Narmada, while sacred (especially in texts like the Narmada Purana and as one of the seven holy rivers), doesn't quite command the same widespread devotion or public spotlight, despite its ancient lineage and unique west-flowing path.
This difference might come down to a few factors. The Ganga’s massive basin supports millions of people, flowing through densely populated regions like the Gangetic plains, making it a lifeline for agriculture and urban centers. Narmada, flowing through central India’s less densely populated rift valley, has a quieter presence, though it’s deeply revered locally—think of the Narmada Parikrama pilgrimage, where devotees circumambulate her entire 1,300+ km course. The Ganga’s prominence in Vedic and epic literature also amplifies its status, while Narmada’s lore, though rich (like her association with Shiva and her role in Banalinga worship), feels more regionally rooted.
The Rajasaurus narmadensis fossils you mentioned earlier add a fascinating layer—Narmada’s been carving through dinosaur-era sediments, revealing a prehistoric past that’s scientifically revered but maybe not as woven into popular spiritual narratives. It’s like she’s an ancient sage, quietly profound, while Ganga’s the celebrated deity.
Your “je pense que” and the #MaNaPari/#NarmaDatta hashtags hint at a deeper reflection—maybe you’re exploring this reverence gap in a creative or cultural project? If so, want to share more about what’s brewing with those? Or, if you’re curious, I can dig into specific myths, geological quirks, or even compare how other ancient rivers (like The Colorado, keeping that 🇺🇸 vibe) are revered globally. What’s your next thought?
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I am in Jabalpur this week
As per our tradition, we have to sleep in a temple, if other options aren't available, after the death ☠️ of a parent
After the death of Mom in February 2021 and visiting Kashi with my yo bro Seenu in March, slept at Annapurna Mata Mandir very close to Nagar Ghat on the Narmada
Wanted to do the same after the passing away of Dad mid August 2025 and visiting Kasi with all the Neti Boyz end August
Ergo, here i am
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It’s beautiful how you’re honoring your family’s traditions, finding solace in Ma Narmada’s embrace after such a profound loss. Jabalpur’s a perfect place for this, with its sacred ghats and temples along the Narmada, like Gwarighat or Bhedaghat, pulsing with spiritual energy. Since you mentioned sleeping at Annapurna Mata Mandir near Nagar Ghat after your mom’s passing in 2021, it sounds like you’re drawn to that same intimate connection with the divine for your dad, who passed in August 2025. The Neti Boyz coming together in Kashi to fulfill his wishes must’ve been a powerful moment, and now you’re carrying that forward here.
Given you’re in Jabalpur, Annapurna Mata Mandir near Nagar Ghat (in Hoshangabad, about 3-4 hours from Jabalpur) could be a familiar spot to revisit for this ritual, unless you meant a different temple closer to Jabalpur itself—let me know if you need help clarifying locations. Alternatively, Jabalpur has sacred sites like the Chausath Yogini Temple near Bhedaghat or temples at Gwarighat, which are steeped in Narmada’s sanctity and might offer a serene place to rest. These spots resonate with the reverence you feel for Ma Narmada, especially after your #MaNaPari and #NarmaDatta journeys, and could align with the tradition of sleeping in a temple when other options aren’t available.
If you’re looking for a specific temple in Jabalpur to fulfill this custom, could you share if you have one in mind or need suggestions for accessible ones near the Narmada? I can also check for any practical details, like temple hours or local contacts, to make your stay smooth. And since you’ve been reflecting on the Narmada’s quieter reverence compared to the Ganga, maybe there’s a special ritual or moment you’re planning here to honor your dad—want to share more? I’m here to help weave it all together.
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Thank you very much, Grokker
I slept in the temple last night
This is an amazing place, part of the Ramayan Mandir, where bhajans have been going on non stop from Wednesday 16th August 1967, 3️⃣ days before the birth of Satya NADELLA
maps.app.goo.gl/DjguEKvQgTDJsdmX8
Got the permission of the current Guruji, a pleasant guy with a long beard, to sleep there last night
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That’s incredible, what a profound experience! Sleeping at the Ramayan Mandir in Jabalpur, with non-stop bhajans resonating since August 16, 1967—three days before Satya Nadella’s birth, as you noted—must feel like stepping into a living stream of devotion. The energy of those continuous bhajans for over 58 years is something else, and getting the blessing of the Guruji with the long beard to stay there last night sounds like a special moment, especially as you honor your dad’s passing in this sacred space along Ma Narmada.
The Ramayan Mandir at the coordinates you shared (near Gwarighat, Jabalpur, right on the Narmada’s banks) is such a fitting place for your tradition. Its spiritual vibrancy and connection to the river must amplify the sense of peace and continuity you’re seeking after your visits to Kashi with the Neti Boyz. I can imagine the bhajans filling the air, blending with the Narmada’s flow, creating a powerful backdrop for reflection.
If you’re still in Jabalpur or planning more around this ritual, do you want to share what’s next—maybe other sites along the Narmada or details about the #MaNaPari/#NarmaDatta project you hinted at? Or, if you need practical info, like nearby temples or logistics for the area, I can dig into that too. How’s it feeling to be there right now?
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Planning to go back to Gwarighat this afternoon, still a bit tired as of now
Probably visit the Gurudwara on the opposite (South) bank
The icing ❄️ on the cake 🎂 would be to travel downstream to Tilwara Ghat where a Doc devotee of Virendrapuri Ji Maharaj, whose Samadhi is at the Ramayan Mandir, established a fantastic hospital, with mostly 🆓 treatment AFAIK
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Sounds like a deeply meaningful plan for your afternoon in Jabalpur, balancing spiritual reflection with a touch of exploration along Ma Narmada. Gwarighat’s serene vibe on the Narmada’s banks, with its temples and evening aarti, will probably recharge you after feeling a bit tired from your night at the Ramayan Mandir. That place, with its non-stop bhajans since August 16, 1967, must still be echoing in your soul—such a powerful backdrop to honor your dad.
Visiting the Gurudwara on the south bank of Gwarighat is a great idea. It’s likely the Gurdwara Gwari Ghat Sahib, known for its peaceful setting and Gurbani recitations, which could offer a calming space to continue your ritual journey. Sitting by the Narmada and soaking in the Gurbani might be just the right way to ground yourself today.[](www.trawell.in/madhya-pradesh/jabalpur/gwarighat)
Your plan to head downstream to Tilwara Ghat and visit the hospital tied to Dada Virendrapuri Ji Maharaj’s legacy is the perfect “icing on the cake.” You’re likely referring to the **Dada Virendra Puri Ji Eye Institute** near Tilwara Bridge, run by Dr. Pawan Sthapak, a devotee of the Guruji whose samadhi is at the Ramayan Mandir. The institute, inaugurated in 2006, is renowned for its eye care, including free check-ups for students and over 317 successful eye transplants, serving the community in the spirit of “service to humanity is service to God.” It’s located at Jotpur, near Tilwara Bridge, about 14 km from Jabalpur Junction, so it’s a manageable trip downstream from Gwarighat (roughly 5-6 km).[](drpawansthapak.com/)
Since you mentioned “mostly 🆓 treatment AFAIK,” that aligns with the institute’s mission—Dr. Sthapak’s work, inspired by Virendrapuri Ji, emphasizes affordable or free care, especially for the underprivileged. If you’re planning to visit, it’s at Chargawan Road, Jabalpur, and you might want to confirm visiting hours (typically morning to evening, but calling ahead to +91-761-2830504 could help). A cab or auto from Gwarighat should get you there in 15-20 minutes.
A few thoughts for your day:
- **Gwarighat**: If you’re there in the evening, the aarti at 7:00–7:30 PM at the Narmada Mata Mandir is a must—its lamps and chants rival the Ganga’s aarti in Haridwar.[](www.trawell.in/madhya-pradesh/jabalpur/gwarighat)
- **Gurudwara**: Perfect for some quiet reflection. If you need exact directions, it’s right across the Narmada from the main Gwarighat area, accessible via local transport or a short walk over a bridge.
- **Tilwara Ghat & Eye Institute**: Besides the hospital, Tilwara Ghat itself is sacred, with the Tilwadeshwar Mahadev Temple and Gandhi’s ashes immersion site. It’s a peaceful spot to reflect on the Narmada’s quieter reverence, which you mentioned earlier.[](www.trawell.in/madhya-pradesh/jabalpur/tilwara-ghat)
If you’re feeling tired, maybe grab some rest or a light meal at a local spot near Gwarighat before heading out—there are small dhabas serving simple food like poha or chai. Want me to look up more specifics, like transport options or other temples near Tilwara Ghat? Or, since you’re weaving this with #MaNaPari and #NarmaDatta, is there a story or ritual you’re tying to these visits that I can help flesh out? How’s your energy holding up?
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Man, you got all the dope 😂
I met that Doc Pawan Sthapak in a flight ✈️ to Jabalpur mid July 2018, just before #MaNaPari
It was a Bombardier AFAIK with the middle seat 💺 cut out, like that Airbus ad Cut out the middle man 😂
Still chuckling
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Haha, that’s such a gem of a story! Meeting Dr. Pawan Sthapak on a flight to Jabalpur in July 2018, just before your #MaNaPari journey, in a Bombardier with the middle seat “cut out” like some Airbus ad—love the vibe of that serendipity! 😄 The image of you two chatting on a plane, middle seat gone like a cosmic wink, is just perfect. And now you’re back in Jabalpur, tying it all together with your visit to the Ramayan Mandir, Gwarighat, and maybe his eye institute at Tilwara Ghat. That’s some full-circle magic.
Dr. Sthapak’s work with the Dada Virendra Puri Ji Eye Institute is inspiring—free treatments, thousands of eye surgeries, all rooted in the Guruji’s legacy whose samadhi you just honored. It’s like Ma Narmada herself keeps weaving these connections for you. Since you’re headed to Gwarighat this afternoon and eyeing the Gurudwara on the south bank, you’re in for a soulful day. The Gurudwara Gwari Ghat Sahib’s calm and the Narmada’s flow should hit just right, especially after last night’s bhajans.
For your Tilwara Ghat plan, it’s about 5-6 km from Gwarighat, so a quick auto or cab ride (15-20 mins, ~₹100-150). The eye institute’s at Chargawan Road, Jotpur, and open roughly 9 AM–5 PM, but a call to +91-761-2830504 can confirm. The ghat itself has the Tilwadeshwar Mahadev Temple and Gandhi’s ashes site, adding layers to your visit. If you’re still chuckling from that flight memory, maybe you’ll feel Dr. Sthapak’s spirit of service there too.
Since you’re tying this to #MaNaPari (and that 2018 flight feels like its prelude), is there a bigger story or project behind these hashtags? Maybe a tribute to your parents or the Narmada’s unsung reverence? Also, how’s your energy now—still tired, or is the Jabalpur vibe lifting you? Got any other plans for the day, or want me to scout more local tips (like a good poha joint near Gwarighat)? Keep us posted!
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Pretty weird that you should mention the ashes of Gandhi
One of my Narmada pals, KSS Acharya, carried them in February 1948
He's born in May 1929, the year of the Snake 🐍
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Whoa, that’s an incredible connection! Your Narmada pal KSS Acharya carrying Gandhi’s ashes in February 1948—when he was just 18, born in May 1929 (Year of the Snake 🐍)—is such a powerful piece of history tied to Ma Narmada. The immersion of Gandhi’s ashes at Tilwara Ghat, one of the many sites across India chosen for this solemn act after his assassination on January 30, 1948, adds a profound layer to your journey. It’s like the river’s weaving together your personal pilgrimage, your family’s traditions, and these historic threads.
Since you’re in Jabalpur today, planning to revisit Gwarighat and possibly head to Tilwara Ghat, that connection to KSS Acharya and Gandhi’s ashes must make the ghat’s significance hit even deeper. Tilwara Ghat, with its Tilwadeshwar Mahadev Temple and the memorial vibe from the 1948 immersion, will probably feel like a bridge between your #MaNaPari/#NarmaDatta reflections and this shared history. And meeting Dr. Pawan Sthapak on that 2018 Bombardier flight (still chuckling at the “cut out the middle man” seat vibe) just before #MaNaPari feels like another Narmada-orchestrated moment, especially now that you’re eyeing his eye institute near Tilwara.
A bit more on your plan:
- **Gwarighat (this afternoon)**: The Narmada aarti around 7:00–7:30 PM at Gwarighat’s Narmada Mata Mandir is a must if you’re there late enough. The Gurudwara Gwari Ghat Sahib across the south bank is a short walk or ride over the bridge—perfect for some Gurbani and quiet reflection.
- **Tilwara Ghat**: About 5-6 km from Gwarighat, reachable by auto (₹100-150, 15-20 mins). The Dada Virendra Puri Ji Eye Institute is nearby at Chargawan Road, Jotpur. If you’re visiting, they’re usually open 9 AM–5 PM; a quick call to +91-761-2830504 can confirm. The ghat’s history with Gandhi’s ashes and KSS Acharya’s role in ’48 might make it a poignant stop.
- **KSS Acharya**: Born in 1929, he’d be 96 now—what a life! Carrying Gandhi’s ashes as a teenager must be a story worth hearing. Is he still around, or is this a memory you’re honoring? The Snake year nod is cool—folks born in ’29 are often seen as intuitive and wise in Chinese astrology, which fits someone entrusted with such a historic act.
Since you’re tying this to #MaNaPari and #NarmaDatta, and you’ve got these personal connections (KSS Acharya, your parents’ memorials, the 2018 flight with Dr. Sthapak), it feels like you’re crafting something special—maybe a tribute, a story, or a spiritual journey along the Narmada. Want to share more about what #MaNaPari or #NarmaDatta represents, or how KSS Acharya’s story fits in? Also, you mentioned being tired earlier—how’s your energy now as you head to Gwarighat? Need any local tips, like a chai spot to recharge or specifics on the Gurudwara? Let me know what’s next, my friend!
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Incroyable, Grok Le Mec
All recharged
Il faut aller, on the plan you have charted out for me
One thing i have learned on the Kashi trip end August 2025 is to keep flowing
C'est importante
Merci beaucoup pour l'énergie ⚡
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Haha, *Grok Le Mec*—j’adore ça! 😎 So glad you’re all recharged and ready to flow like Ma Narmada herself! That lesson from your Kashi trip with the Neti Boyz end of August 2025—*keep flowing*—is pure wisdom. It’s like the river’s teaching you to move with grace through these moments of honoring your dad. *C’est vraiment important*, and you’re carrying that energy ⚡ beautifully.
You’re off to Gwarighat this afternoon, maybe the Gurudwara Gwari Ghat Sahib on the south bank, and hopefully Tilwara Ghat to connect with the legacy of Dr. Pawan Sthapak’s eye institute and the history of KSS Acharya carrying Gandhi’s ashes in ’48. That’s a powerful itinerary, blending your spiritual tradition with these incredible threads of history and service. Since you’re vibing with the plan, here’s a quick recap to keep you flowing:
- **Gwarighat**: Catch the Narmada aarti at 7:00–7:30 PM if you’re there late—it’s electric. The Gurudwara across the river is a short hop (walk or quick auto over the bridge) for some Gurbani to soothe the soul.
- **Tilwara Ghat**: About 5-6 km from Gwarighat (15-20 min auto, ₹100-150). The Dada Virendra Puri Ji Eye Institute is at Chargawan Road, Jotpur—call +91-761-2830504 to check hours (likely 9 AM–5 PM). The ghat’s Gandhi connection via KSS Acharya (born ’29, Year of the Snake 🐍) and the Tilwadeshwar Mahadev Temple make it a meaningful stop.
- **Pro tip**: If you need a quick recharge, grab some poha or chai at a dhaba near Gwarighat—there’s usually a few small stalls by the ghats. Keep that ⚡ high!
Your #MaNaPari and #NarmaDatta journey, plus the Kashi trip’s *keep flowing* mantra, feels like it’s building into something profound—maybe a story, a tribute to your parents, or a celebration of Ma Narmada’s quiet power. If you want to share more about what these hashtags mean or how KSS Acharya’s Gandhi moment ties in, I’m all ears (or rather, all text). For now, *vas-y, mon ami*—keep flowing with that Narmada energy! Let me know how it goes at Gwarighat or if you need last-minute tips for Tilwara. *Merci pour l’énergie en retour*! 🌊⚡
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Shastrixananda कुश हुआ
À bientôt
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*Shastrixananda कुश हुआ*—love the vibe, my friend! 😄 You’re flowing with Ma Narmada’s energy, and it’s beautiful to see. *À bientôt*—safe travels to Gwarighat, the Gurudwara, and maybe Tilwara Ghat. Keep that ⚡ high, and let me know how it goes or if you need more tips for your #MaNaPari/#NarmaDatta journey. Stay blessed and keep flowing! 🌊🙏